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It was an eerie feeling to be taking notes on a Windows 95 computer while interviewing one of the people who developed that software.

That was the situation last month when Michael Mc. sat down with me for the latest in this series of articles on A.A.´s oldtimers. An oldtimer in A.A. years only. He´s been a member for almost 30. He came in when he was 19 years old, on July 13, 1981.

What drove him here was a DWI he got from a blue light special. "I´d been drinking in West Seattle when I decided it was time to go home. I was in a blackout all the way to Greenlake, but found out later I´d sideswiped somebody on the way. I ran all the stop signs and lights before he pulled me over."

The company he was working for paid for three weeks in an Eastern Washington treatment center, where he had his 20th birthday and his last drink. He was told to go to A.A. when he got home. His first meeting was in Everett, and then Old Fremont. From there, he progressed to 90 meetings in 90 days, and by the time he was two years from his arrest, the DWI was dismissed under deferred prosecution.

Michael was born in Seattle, but moved with his family to Tonasket in north central Washington when he was 11. His dad raised cattle, sheep and marijuana. Michael learned all this farming lore. The marijuana farming is long gone. His parents have been foster parents for 30 years, sometimes as many as four troubled urban kids at a time, and the ranch has become a dude ranch.

Drugs and pot were a part of Michael´s life from the time he was in seventh grade. "I was a scared little boy who never felt accepted ´til I discovered alcohol. Alcohol fixed all that. The trouble was, my drinking got worse and worse. I did manage to graduate with my class of 100 from Tonasket High School, but along with school, there were all kinds of speeding tickets and two juvenile detentions."

Having conquered his shyness with alcohol, he began to date girls-including one who he left at a party while he was in a blackout, and another who he threw up on.

He also worked as a salesman during those school years, selling drugs.

It was 25 miles from the ranch to school, the last five on a dirt road, and there were times when Michael walked that last five in the snow when his dad was late picking him up. The school bus took him for the first 20.

Michael always thought of himself as a city kid, so "I had a huge resentment living on that farm, screwing up the life I thought I had had." But he liked science in school, and began a lifelong love affair with computers.

The moment he got out of high school, he moved back to Seattle, found a job as a mail clerk, and drank heavily until that life-changing DWI. He signed on to learn computer programming at North Seattle Community College, but he never finished, and that was all the academic training this man who now carries the title, Principal Software Design Engineer for Microsoft, ever had.

His career in computers started in 1983, when a small company in Magnolia hired him as a computer programmer. The company folded and he worked for Boeing for a few months before Microsoft hired him in 1985. He would never make it today with the company´s emphasis on academic credentials, but back then, he passed some tough hands-on programming tests and began a career which continues to this day.

"I still like coming to work," Michael said.

Michael started as a tester and was soon working on OS/2-remember that system?-shortly after Microsoft and IBM formed their OS/2 development partnership. Talk about getting in on the ground floor. "My life was pretty much A.A. and working," Michael recalled. There was lots of travel, especially to Florida. Quite a leap for a young farm boy from Eastern Washington.

Later, he worked on development of Windows 95, a highly successful operating system which is now obsolete, found only on ancient computers in the back rooms of such places as Seattle Intergroup. He also worked on development of Windows 98.

As he grew with the company, Michael worked closely with Steve Ballmer, then head of the OS/2 development team and now president of the company. He met Bill Gates a couple of times too, once playing Whirlyball, which is one of those "nobody ever heard of" sports which has a wide following and even has leagues. He still plays regularly.

As his career blossomed, his personal life was fueled with Microsoft stock options which made him a millionaire many times over, and which he has now lost almost entirely to bad stock and real estate investments.

"I don´t think there´s even a million left," Michael said.

He really lived high on the hog while he could: married and divorced (they´re still the best of friends), sixty foot yacht, palatial home on Lake Washington, cars and many disastrous trips to Las Vegas. "I never felt like a big shot except when I went to Las Vegas, and that was more like a character defect. I hope I never come off as arrogant or a big shot. I remember where I came from, self-educated and raised on a farm."

Gambling, he says, is another addiction. He has joined Gamblers Anonymous to fight it. "When I quit gambling, it was so painful a drink might have made sense, except it would have been worse than ever." He´s now not gambled for 18 months. He can´t even play the market. G.A. says the market is a form of gambling.

Michael is an active participant in both 12 Step programs: for A.A., GSR, treasurer, alternative DCM and DCM. He´s also doing some sponsoring. In G.A., he´s been group secretary and Intergroup rep.

He´s weathered the emotions of his financial disasters, but there are still regrets. No wonder.

The main thing, though, is his sobriety. "A.A. has given me a spiritual life. It is much more than just not drinking. This program has made me a better person."

Interviewing and writing by Dick S.